Swearing abroad

[Benkyo]

Gurdur and I were playing Go last night, with a couple of observers sitting in. I couldn't figure out the results of a given move, and eventually went with a potentially dangerous move and commented '**** it' as I did so.

The observers (who had been silent until now) were clearly offended and responded as such.

This seems really weird to me. Why would anyone get offended about a comment not directed at them, in a gaming space where they are only really there on our sufferance? I know Gurdur wouldn't be bothered, so why were they? So much so they felt the need to end their silence and criticise me for it?

I just went back and edited out the offending word in this very thread, and still not sure why I feel I should (clearly the 'minors' on this board will have used and been exposed to such language endlessly already).

Is swearing really frowned upon abroad? I really think it's different in the UK... But hell, I even remember an American guy here in Japan encouraging his 5 year-old daughter to tell another friend to '**** off', so it can't be a national divide.

Anyway, blows my mind to find there are people out there so bothered by such trivialities.

Comments/abuse welcome.

*goes off to re-read HH policies on swearing*

*relieved to find there are none*

Pretty sure I've sworn a-plenty here without thinking about it before now.

[Gurdur]

.....The observers (who had been silent until now) were clearly offended and responded as such....
Those two were silly gits and quite rude. One was waaaaaaaaay too fond of the sound of his own voice; when he was supposedly "helping" you I was worried that he would turn you off Go altogether --- he was a classic example of someone who "teaches" merely to get a huge ego blast for him. Ass. And conisdering how downright obscene much of daily normal Dutch speech is, I found his comments on swearing remarkably stupid.

[Benkyo]

Yeah, he was very patronising, but given my lack of experience and ability I never turn down teaching, no matter the source. Anyway, how 'bout that swearing thing?

[Gurdur]

Yeah, he was very patronising, but given my lack of experience and ability I never turn down teaching, no matter the source. Anyway, how 'bout that swearing thing?
LIke I said, he was Dutch*, so objecting to swearing was reeeeeally over-camping it on his part. I have no idea as to the nationality of the other person, but I suspect over-camping it up on his part too. Dipshits.
______

* Normal Dutch speech sounds quite obscene often in terms and phrases when translated.

[Gurdur]

....Is swearing really frowned upon abroad? .....
Depends where you are.
It's perfectly OK in Germany and The Netherlands. I guess it's OK in Poland, it's certainly OK in Russia.

Africa is a place where you should avoid it; Australia has a weird double standard.

[Master Taran]

The US also. Double Mother f*$kn standard.

[Chuck]

it's certainly OK in Russia.
Profanity and vulgarity in Russian is much, much stronger than it is in the US or much of Western Europe. Many Russians will be visibly shocked or offended at the use of some words whose translations into English do not communicate their intensity. For example, I once playfully called a (Dutch) female friend a "bitch" in the presence of some Russian women, who were absolutely shocked that I would use that kind of language - so innocuous in English - especially in mixed company. They cut me some slack because I was a foreigner, but I still got a talking to. I learned my lesson and no longer use profanity in Russian unless a native speaker drops one first.

Now in France, on the other hand, it's putain this and nique ta mère la pute that.

[Pastafarian]

Is swearing really frowned upon abroad?
I've heard "experts" say every culture at every time in history has swear words that are considered off-limits. At Language Log (http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/), a linguistics blog I read from time to time, this subject is discussed (http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/002347.html) from time to time, and they don't seem willing to conclude on the subject definitively. It's an interesting and baffling subject.

[Master Taran]

FTW.

[Miranda]

I try to listen carefully when people start swearing, I could learn the perfect new word!

[Alex Bragi]

LIke I said, he was Dutch*, so objecting to swearing was reeeeeally over-camping it on his part. I have no idea as to the nationality of the other person, but I suspect over-camping it up on his part too. Dipshits.
______

* Normal Dutch speech sounds quite obscene often in terms and phrases when translated.

Well, that kind of surprises me since I'm pretty sure that in Dutch, a 'fucker" (not sure how's it's written but it's pronounced "Fooker") is the proper name for an agister, and more specifically one who breeds animals.

By the way, what is "GO", please?

I guess it all depends on what you consider offensive. This Hungarian guy, I used to know, once told me that, in Hungary, the most offensive thing you can call another man, who isn't you're brother-in-law, is "brother-in-law". Weird isn't it?

[Miranda]

http://www.well.com/~mmcadams/gointro.html

[verte]

I think if the Exalted Univited Outside Observers are soooo horribly offended, they should just take their delicate sensibilites the '***' out of there.

[Puck]

Fuck. Fuckity, fuck, fuck, fuck.

If our minors can't handle it, then they don't need to be here. If their parents can't handle it, take the little darlings home. If someone observing a game cam't handle it, fuck 'em. No one is forcing them to stay.

I would never swear in public if there were folks I didn't know about. I'm not out to offend anyone and desire to respect others, but with friends, at home and work, I am myself and will swear with abandon. Swear words are like spices added to dull food.

[Benkyo]

Well said, and exactly my thoughts on the matter. In fact (no really) I was half regretting not having typed "fuckity fuckity fuck fuck, fuckity fuckity fuck" in response to:

Me: "fuck it"

RO1: "?"

RO2: "??"

Me: "What? Dumb move?"

RO1: "Well, the move wasn't dumb, but the comment was"

etc.

So we're thinking along uncannily similar lines there too!

[verte]

Well, who the fuck ASKED him, anyway. :-D

[Ikari Gendou]

I personally do not use profanity all that much, but I know others who do, and I am not offended. If a person uses it all of the time, it really ceases to be profanity.

[Meathead]

Those interlopers that you described seem to be the hoity-toity type that make my skin crawl for I swear like a sailor.

There is no way that you were wrong for using profanity. You were in your domain so to speak, and you were exercising your right of free speech.

[Benkyo]

The word 'profanity' seems so archaic and rooted in Old Testament mythology, with a similar meaning to blasphemy and sacrilege. At least that's the only way secular people would use it in Britain, though maybe very Christian people would use it to refer to swear words. Guess that's just another way American and British English have diverged... I'll never tire of spotting them!

[Miranda]

I thought the "profane" was a synonym with "vulgar" more than blaphemy? I could be wrong, though, I haven't paid that much attention!

[Gurdur]

I thought the "profane" was a synonym with "vulgar" more than blaphemy?
Historically yes, modern-wise no.

And historically where "vulgar" simply meant non-aristocratic.

[Pastafarian]

The word 'profanity' seems so archaic and rooted in Old Testament mythology, with a similar meaning to blasphemy and sacrilege. At least that's the only way secular people would use it in Britain, though maybe very Christian people would use it to refer to swear words. Guess that's just another way American and British English have diverged... I'll never tire of spotting them!
I thought the "profane" was a synonym with "vulgar" more than blaphemy? I could be wrong, though, I haven't paid that much attention!
Apparently we Yankees use the word "profane" both ways. Samuel Johnson wrote, "Dictionaries are like watches: the worst is better than none, and the best cannot be expected to go quite true." All the same, the American Heritage Dictionary says we use the word thus (http://www.bartleby.com/61/19/P0581900.html).

[Miranda]

Right... vulgar meaning "common".

[Miranda]

Thanks, Pastafarian, I'd never looked that one up.

[Gurdur]

"Profane" was originally simply the opposite of "spiritual"; it meant the "earthly" as opposed to "heavenly".

Like "villain", "vulgar", etc., it gained the new meaning withing the last 200 years --- which BTW is why you find both usages in USA English, since USA English when it started still had both usages, imported from Britain.

[Quath]

It is interesting that certain words get considered tabboo-like. Especially, when there are so many equivalent words. Why is "penis" ok to say in mixed company but "dick" is less appropriate and "cock" is downright rude? They all mean the same thing with the difference in that some words are considered a little more vulgar than others. Maybe that is the point? We want to express a vulgar thought.

Otherwise, we could say "Feces happens" or "Sex you" or "may a deity curse you."